Epic Economy

[Casualty]

Post fail...Quoted someone, edited to the thread and it posted by accident. I have failed.

[Barbie]

This thread isn't based on that single statement. It's based on the economy around it, that's why. I was looking forward to a GM actually reading through and giving their own opinion since they reside outside of it. It's depressing to see only the first line read and then responded to. I suppose that's just me, I could really care less though for the EC rumor, it's not my issue. It's not even on a list of concerns. Hopefully someone else has something more interesting to say...Hopefully.

I'm sorry to say it but if you wanted an intertectual debate on economy then you have come to the wrong place my friend

[Casualty]

I'm sorry to say it but if you wanted an intertectual debate on economy then you have come to the wrong place my friend

I have only the hope to be proven wrong.

[Feone]

I'm sorry to say it but if you wanted an intertectual debate on economy then you have come to the wrong place my friend

Not everyone is limitted to replies where every third or fourth word is an insult!

At the original post (too long to quote) I think you  overlook a few things.

You're forgetting that crafting in this game is almost non-existant. It's not time consuming and results are usually predictable (or the result is bound like r8r).  As such crafting something with profit is not something that happens in EPW unless you get lucky on an engrave.

There are also multiple other currencies to take into account. Supply Tokens and Gold.

An item of major importance to gear is rep badges. r8r is the endgame gear for every class (with very few exceptions) at the moment and as such the 8k rep badges it takes is the main measure for determining EC-gold ratio.  Currently this balances out at about 25 ec - 1 gold.  This ratio is what defines the price of the much lesser demand demonic items.

A second major factor in keeping EC valuable is the r8r reshape forges. It also defines the relation between Supply tokens and Epic coins as they both translate into r8r. A damascene ore costs 10 supply tokens or 30 ec in the forge. With people running out of things to reforge more and more supply tokens are going into r8r taking over some of EC's use there. This can be shown in people selling damascene for 20-25 ec.  Setting the exchange value of supply tokens at somewhere around 2.5 ec to 1 supply token. Making 1 gold worth approximately 10 supply tokens. Just about every single other item is priced based on these exchange ratios & whichever currency has the cheapest crafting option for it.

It's not really that theres a massive shortage of EC causing demonic items to fall in price, it's just that theres a far higher demand item in the game that sets the exchange ratio for gold to ec with demonic items ending up far cheaper if bought with gold instead of the ec forge.

[Casualty]

Not everyone is limitted to replies where every third or fourth word is an insult!

At the original post (too long to quote) I think you  overlook a few things.

You're forgetting that crafting in this game is almost non-existant. It's not time consuming and results are usually predictable (or the result is bound like r8r).  As such crafting something with profit is not something that happens in EPW unless you get lucky on an engrave.

There are also multiple other currencies to take into account. Supply Tokens and Gold.

An item of major importance to gear is rep badges. r8r is the endgame gear for every class (with very few exceptions) at the moment and as such the 8k rep badges it takes is the main measure for determining EC-gold ratio.  Currently this balances out at about 25 ec - 1 gold.  This ratio is what defines the price of the much lesser demand demonic items.

A second major factor in keeping EC valuable is the r8r reshape forges. It also defines the relation between Supply tokens and Epic coins as they both translate into r8r. A damascene ore costs 10 supply tokens or 30 ec in the forge. With people running out of things to reforge more and more supply tokens are going into r8r taking over some of EC's use there. This can be shown in people selling damascene for 20-25 ec.  Setting the exchange value of supply tokens at somewhere around 2.5 ec to 1 supply token. Making 1 gold worth approximately 10 supply tokens. Just about every single other item is priced based on these exchange ratios & whichever currency has the cheapest crafting option for it.

It's not really that theres a massive shortage of EC causing demonic items to fall in price, it's just that theres a far higher demand item in the game that sets the exchange ratio for gold to ec with demonic items ending up far cheaper if bought with gold instead of the ec forge.

If you want I'm happy to redo this entire thread and include absolutely everything I "missed." The point I was coming to was to simply say that realistically speaking through the majority of the server supply and demand, along with profit, seem to be in a massive decline causing a fluctuation in inflammation of certain things. It's not limited at all to just Demonic, Dragon, and EC products. Of course the goal of the R8 gear is a high stake and does call for such. I can't say how you can claim to be so accurate to your gear though, that I'd love to know myself. I'm tired of the relentless reshaping and getting the ugliest sum of attributes. Regardless of that, you can't really say that supply tokens can even be considered a form of currency really. If you don't believe me, then why is it no one wishes to do business with me if I offer them over EC? I can say they're of a better value and they are, but someone who just got a new mount or flyer would say differently wouldn't they? When you think of the economy you can't look at the top, you have to see the spectrum of it's reach. You also have to consider Supply Tokens aren't really a matter for everyone to get. Account for all before you analyze a single. Don't get me wrong, what you've said isn't anything further from the truth, but it's at a standing point and for the last. Nothing exactly for the matters before hand.

[Feone]

Hmm, Im not sure what would fix that problem though. The only real endgame currency sink is the reshape forges (and new alt characters.) so it will probably stay like that for now.  I would definitely not be opposed to seeing a few new ways of farming though. It gets kind of boring to farm tens of thousands of ec just to reshape.

[Barbie]

There are also multiple other currencies to take into account. Supply Tokens and Gold.

Supply tokens are non tradable and Gold (Or items bought with gold) are usually bought with EC. Ultimately, the main currency will always be EC. To be honest, I don't know why the emphasis is on EC right now. The market is healthy, prices are static and have remained this way for a while now.

[Feone]

Supply tokens are also somewhat tradable in that they can be turned into r8r mats that can be traded. Seals of war, weapon tokens & engraves on items can also be traded.

Gold is somewhat tradable too by turning it into items.

[Fatigue]

I have a small idea for an endgame EC sink.
Gambling.
Make quests where you lose 10/100/1000 ec for a chance to get half, the same amount, nothing or 10x etc. Make the rates for winning and losing fair. It will allow people to waste 1000 or turn 100 into the 1000 they needed for r8r.

[Barbie]

The point I was coming to was to simply say that realistically speaking through the majority of the server supply and demand, along with profit, seem to be in a massive decline causing a fluctuation in inflammation of certain things.

Massive decline? Honestly, I don't see that. You picked up earlier on the dragon armours vs Demonic Tokens. If we run off current conversions where 1 Gold = 25 EC then an armour token will cost you 125 EC. So you are matching that cost against dragon armour and saying either 1. Demonic too High or Dragon too low.
Whats the cost of Dragon then? Its simply this:

125 EC + 5 WS Crystals.

So what does that cost? Not much I've seen them sell at 10M each but yes people sell higher. Now we work backwards if 1 EC is worth 2 Mil each WS crystal is 5 EC but as you know you can always buy WS crystals for EC directly and get them for 4 EC sometimes even less. So the price of dragon armour becomes 145 EC at a good price minus and refines and Stones. All those mats though are consiidered to be 'No expense'

All the sales I have seen conform to this. You can buy a piece of armour for around 150 EC easily and sure some people sell less and other sell more but as long as you know where the middle ground is you can then judge how much your need is weighted against the price offered and that will tell you if your purchase is worth it or not.

If you care to share some examples of how you believe the economy is in decline then I would love to see them. But to be honest I have not seen any as of yet.

[Barbie]

Supply tokens are also somewhat tradable in that they can be turned into r8r mats that can be traded. Seals of war, weapon tokens & engraves on items can also be traded.

Gold is somewhat tradable too by turning it into items.

All of which are then bought with EC. The process you described is simply a conversion of Items into currency. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying items are not a 'currency' in their own right, because to some degree they are. All I was saying is that EC is the main currency and I am failing to see how it is in decline

[Feone]

All of which are then bought with EC. The process you described is simply a conversion of Items into currency. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying items are not a 'currency' in their own right, because to some degree they are. All I was saying is that EC is the main currency and I am failing to see how it is in decline

I agree on that point. EC still comes from a decent amount of instances and is very much used. However removal of trial mats -> ec did cut a major source of them. But it's somewhat covered now that supply tokens can make r8r mats at a cheaper rate causing players to trade others instead of sinking ec into the forge more of the time.  (slightly cheaper, to make these trades possible.)

[milco342]

I have a small idea for an endgame EC sink.
Gambling.
Make quests where you lose 10/100/1000 ec for a chance to get half, the same amount, nothing or 10x etc. Make the rates for winning and losing fair. It will allow people to waste 1000 or turn 100 into the 1000 they needed for r8r.

am i the only one who loves this idea

[dorothyerika]

am i the only one who loves this idea

I like it aswell,but if you lose that amount of ec,you would be pissed ;3(600-2k ec)

[Vengeous ~]

Usually nothing piques my drunken curiosity but i do have a suggestion or two regardless of how stupd and retarded they may be. Why not make ec a prize in NW? Turn it into a gambling system (taken from the gambling quest idea) Say you start off betting you would get 50 kills rewarding you 100 ec while failure to do so will result in doubling down? It sounded less stupid in my head...