Epic Perfect World

How to: nerf requests.

Offline Feone

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There have been a lot of nerf requests on the forum lately, a lot of them absolutely idiotic. So heres a guide with a few pointers on making a nerf request. Maybe then we won't have a spam of useless nerf threads drowning out the few that are actually reasonable.

So, you want something nerfed badly enough to come to the forums and post about it then start out with the following:

Step 1: Search.

Theres a good chance someone has already mentioned it. If it's not yet in an appropriate topic you can at the very least gather up the opinions that may be posted somewhat offtopic elsewhere to save a lot of repeat posts. If it is in an appropriate topic then post there instead of making a new one.

Step 2:


Before posting a new topic, make sure your request is at least well thought out and make sure you actually know what you're talking about. "I lost and now my opponents class must be OP." will lead nowhere but trolling, flaming & a locked topic.

Step 3:

Put together a logical and preferably impartial argument as to why this particular thing needs a nerf.

So, how do you determine if something is unbalanced? While I'm sure some people will disagree, here are the things I think need to be considered to make a nerf request reasonable.

People like being OP. If a class is OP it will almost always lead to more and more people playing it. Since there are 10 classes, if more than about 20-25% of pk is that particular class it's a pretty good indication there is something wrong.

How many classes can do it?  Does it work on all classes or only a few?  If done succesfully, how much damage does it deal compared to the time it takes to cast it? (Or other negative effect on them.)

Are you comparing normal gear? (Average right now is decently-statted r8r.) If  only 2 people on the server have the gear required to make something OP then you are probably better off sending Agatio a message about certain extreme cases of gear needing fixing rather than making a nerf thread.

Another thing to consider is the cost of doing a combo/move compared to the cost of countering it.
Things to consider here are:
1) Chi.  How much chi does it cost to do the combo/move?
2) Genie. How much genie energy is used up performing the combo/move?
3) Time. How many skills need to be casted, how long does this take?
4) Cooldown. How long does it take before it can be repeated?
5) Skill, how hard is it to do the combo overall? (Stunlocks for example)

Major factors in countering are:

1) Genie, If possible, how much energy is needed to counter this combo? (Add significant points for single-purpose genie skills like heart of steel, soul of fire or evil ward.)
2) Cooldown, If possible, how much cooldown does the counter have?
3) Chi, if possible, how much chi does it take to counter this combo? (If any at all.)
4) Prevention, how easy is it to block one or more aspects of the combo by forcing the opponent to use their chi/genie/cooldowns.
5) Skill, how hard is it to do the optimal counter? (For example countering a stun with faith is easy, predicting a stun & using fortify to block it is a bit harder.)

And lastly, how easy can the counter be countered? (For example, a 3spark can be countered by purge, but purge can be stopped with AD or faith.) Rate this on the same points as the above.

While it's very hard to say exactly when something is OP if, after checking the above, the costs of using it are vastly lower than the costs of countering it then the combo is potentially OP.  Keep in mind that prevention is also possible, sins may not be able to survive much but they can counter a lot by stunning their opponent.

People will never completely agree on what is or isnt OP so be prepared to debate your opinion.
If you take a good look at all the things involved in using or countering it and can present a coherent & logical argument as to why exactly it is  OP then people are much more likely to take it seriously.


If, after checking all the above, you decide it is worth posting about then keep the thread civilised. If you have to insult someone that disagrees just to respond to their point then you have already lost the debate.

Always ignore trolls and flamers, nothing but more of the same trashtalk & a locked topic ever happen if you (or others) reply.

On a final note:

1.many people think perfect balance is possible, but it's not (even though the game is called perfect world it ain't perfect brothers/sisters) because every character has it's pro's and con's.
So what does this mean ?
It simply means that some characters are slightly better in mass pk or are oriented at killing single tanks such as barbs and some are slightly better balanced in 1v1s, so before you speak try to think a bit what impact would your suggestion have in overall gameplay and don't act selfish.

2.Map locations are also always important for example an EA would find out flatter maps more likely then hilly maps where as you are well assuming kind of unplayable for them.

3.So knowing the 1,2 don't expect to be accepted for 1v1 event if you are an EA or psychic or don't even try cause there are counter classes and especially those classes are oriented more for mass pk then for 1v1's.


Last Edit: Mar 24, 2014, 03:03 pm by Feone

Offline ☣EvilEye23☣

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I like this guide.
LightningI—150 wizard
⚔     ⚔     ⚔
  1 x  -  c a n a d a 

Offline Jeromey

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Hopefully this will be the savior to ridiculous or un-thought nerf thread. Good guide.

Offline Feone

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Bump, because some threads seem to be in need of this.

Offline ☣EvilEye23☣

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Bump, because some threads seem to be in need of this.
This should probably also get a sticky :/ maybe
LightningI—150 wizard
⚔     ⚔     ⚔
  1 x  -  c a n a d a 

Offline Sleep

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Can I, like, sticky this?


You don't want to exasperate GN Sleep  :pig-11: :pig-37:

Offline ☣EvilEye23☣

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Can I, like, sticky this?
DO IT!
LightningI—150 wizard
⚔     ⚔     ⚔
  1 x  -  c a n a d a 

Offline elllieee

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Can I, like, sticky this?

probably should with soo many irrelevant nerf posts :X

Offline Consist

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Can I, like, sticky this?

Who types "like", anyways, why'd you delete my thread?

Offline Sleep

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probably should with soo many irrelevant nerf posts :X

Stickied. I'd also like to add:

Click here for Antihero's Amazing Guide to Searching.


You know, if they don't know how to search.


You don't want to exasperate GN Sleep  :pig-11: :pig-37:

Offline Sleep

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Who types "like", anyways, why'd you delete my thread?

I added a poll option, nothing more. If you have any further questions, feel free to PM me. This isn't the thread for it.


You don't want to exasperate GN Sleep  :pig-11: :pig-37:

Offline SlowPokie

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Make max channel 85-89 for all toons for
Archers 55-70
Is
Too much mainly
Since high damage and high crit they don't need to be insta not qqing ijsimg

Offline Feone

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This is a guide on how to write a nerf request that isn't just "QQ  I lost, nerf plis.".

 Please keep nerf or not discussions in their own topics, theres no point in getting this locked over a discussion  about something that doesn't belong here.

Offline Elena

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This thing should be bumped. Nefing threads are incoming.


Offline Drive

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This thing should be bumped. Nefing threads are incoming.
Inactive.
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