Every other class can use something on itself that is effective enough to not waste pot/genie resources. Psy and ep are the 2 other worst cases after wiz, but less in need of antistun because they can both use something on themselves (rather than change location) to effectively mitigate cc. -Psychic will can be used as a preventative measure to mitigate inevitable cc that will occur from entering proximity to others. It can also be used as a reactionary response to purify debuffs. -Soul of silence and stunning punishes attackers by forcing them to waste resources and can be paired with psy will or white to provide enough protection.
Distance and range move and affect the scale not only upwards but downwards as well, from mass down to 1v1s. The thrust of my argument is that which is granted in one must be granted in all. I have nothing against the Undine buff as long as changes are applied across all necessary range modifications for which Undine would set the precedent.The concept of distance manipulation is not exclusive to single targets. Instead of manipulating distance between a target and yourself, the scale morphs into manipulating the distance between an enemy party and your own, then into manipulating distance between multiple parties in one faction against the enemy faction. The shape this takes is usually that of a round cluster, the clusters then rotate, transform, sometimes party and faction leaders will try to outmaneuver each other's rotation, then the cluster will form into two parallel lines separated by nothing more than distance. Naturally there will be multiple enemies at multiple locations, that is the entire concept of movement and rotating but there is a clear distance between one party and the next aside from CC. Party leaders make decisions involving distances naturally, as when to push in or move out. The concept of distance is actually very complex, unlike a skill mechanic which does not scale.
CC that Psychic will avoids:non aoe physical attack based CC's with no elemental damage on the caster equippedCC that Psychic will does not avoid:-Duskblade tele stuns-Duskblade with elemental pot-Sin stun teleport-Sins with condensed thorn-Tornado-Roar-Nova-Earth Vector-Reel In-Barb Ulti-Barb Knockdown-Occult-BM knockdown if wiz or elemetal buff-Mystic plants-Mystic Thicket-Mystic in general-Stormbringers in general-basically every CCThe premise that Psychic Will 'avoids' CC is false. For 1 spark (a waste of resources) you could PURIFY CC if your casting time is not slowed by effects too badly and if you aren't sage who can do that without chi cost (but long ass casting time even longer if mystic plants fked your CT) and in the time of this vulnerable period inside psychic will or purifying with bubble you will get aimed because you lag behind the 'cluster' due to barely any mobility without wasting genie or in situations where flyers are not an option (HB)Just like every other class, Wizards have a specific way to enter offensive nature and exit offensive nature without loss of resources in doing so if done correctly or carefully. Here is a hypothetical:Two squads are rotating, there is a wizard with 399 chi, the wizard notices that the enemy squads archers are clumped together and they have not used wingrise, The wizard also notices he is not being focused, he casts ulti he stealth leaps, he uses mountain press, hail, blade tempest, and while their main parties DDs are still in CC or died from the aoe attempt, he tries as fast as he can to LEAP BACK to his squad while hopefully wasting some of the other parties genies or killed them, then he puts on water shell and sets up for a rush with pill and ice prison after this in a minute.This is a good example of how wizard can create setups in mass pk without being punished to lose resources, and also without an antistun. Whether or not you will need to use a resource on wizard in this hypothetical is based on how hyperfocused the enemy party is, how carelessly you chose to go in and attempt this (are they in wingrise etc, did one of them recently use IG and is still inside IG? etc) Wizard can and does make do with what it has now. I'm not saying it having an antistun is nessicarily a bad thing, but it would also mess up many 1v1 scenarios for wizard (aka ruin the vibe of) such as Wiz vs Wiz, wiz vs barb, wiz vs ea would become easier to win, this would alter many dynamics. Now I am only saying if wizard gets this then psy and DD Cleric should as well. Psychic's strat for causing havoc on a cluster of archers for example is a bit similar, except substitute the stealth leaping / pdef / healing tookit for brief physical damage avoidance and brief white voodoo (which goes away now). End result is usually the same. You either get sniped or you get away with it. This dynamic is not different for wizard or psy. But archers and other classes with antistuns can get away with this way more often without punishment which is why I understand where you are coming from. Regarding your point about wiz range… no undine = target will not die; this is what I meant by the effective range for demon being 27m because undine is necessary for sufficient damage. To reiterate, I am referring to pk not 1v1.Target will definitely die, depending on the target. Obviously its better if you can land undine, but it is usually not necessary on target who is already being AA'd upon. Also its difficult to implement a change which helps mass pk but also does not throw off or harm 1v1sI think wizard doesn't have anti-CC measures mainly because its just very robust and powerful. At the same time it can also be very vulnerable if its lack of anti-CC is exploited during times where they stay a little bit too long in range of a enemy cluster for example. This dichotomy is part of what defines wizard in mass. Should this be altered? Maybe. But how can that be done without effecting its 1v1 dynamic?
You do realise just because menfis hates pking on mage it doesn’t make mages “terrible in mass pk”? Name something menfis doesn’t hate in general. (Gym doesn’t count)It has problem with range and mobility but “can’t kill anything” lmao people get nuked once he uses ult while being pocketed by his vehemets fangirlsNo offense but you don’t even play pw anymore, things change
I agree with your general argument which is why I don’t support making undine 30m, but instead reworking mg to have an antistun. Wiz can often manipulate and maintain distance from a single target effectively when paired with cc (but ultimately is countered by many classes for reasons I won’t discuss). However, exclusively referring to small and mass pk, when in effective attack range (range of undine), demon wiz does not have anything to sufficiently brace itself with, especially against multiple targets with similar range. Neither does sage wiz for that matter, but it can at least avoid many of the frontline attacks due to the option of 30m range attacks. Other than kiting, in which case mg has low value to a team fight, lack of a preventative measure to mitigate or avoid cc means that wiz will inevitably get cced with leap and heal rendered useless, and forced to waste genie. All other classes except ep and psy have antistuns, and those two have generally effective ways to mitigate cc independent of distance manipulation. For these reasons, along with inferior utility skills and aoes, wiz in its current state is not a viable class in mass and small pk compared to other options. I think that’s a shame because it once was a key class, and allowed for magic dd squads rather than the current strict ep, ea, wf, sb, etc. squad composition meta.
I GUESS THE ONLY WAY TO BALANCE MAGE RIGHT NOW IS TO ADD MORE VEHEMENT FANGIRLS TO THE GAME AND LET THEM HEAL MAGE PLAYERS
I think mg definitely has a place in the meta, when I lead pts I'm often happy to have 1-2 mages as they do provide a lot if the player at least knows what he is doing: supportive heals, going in with ice prison, Undine (SB range is the same as mg from Undine range), high dmg, aoe cc. MG is never going to be as good as WF or as popular as EA, SB is still good due to tornado and movement-casting.The solution could be implementing a short anti-stun and movement speed boost as one of the new skills available for all classes, but I doubt this is ever going to happen, along with Undine changes. It seems Inf and the GM's have their specific notions of what is the best for each class, as the input of players never seems to reach them.
This can be addressed with a rework of the class involving the addition of one of the following:-antistun, -purify, -immune, or-substantial short-term damage reduction
yea but all of these mess up dynamcis
a good way to do it to not effect 1v1 is to have a short antistun from leap similar to EA or to have a short 4 second antistun or so tacked onto long CD like Ulti
