Epic Perfect World

Venting about R8

Offline Decency23

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1. Clearly you had to throw in the fact that this is a private server that allows you to level quickly and supposedly gain end game gear within a few weeks to make your statement valid. But it is completely off topic to this thread and to my post. For one, no one has complained about how hard it is to get the gear. Its duh simple. The complaints are about getting decent stats. Btw, my logic is exactly on point because the fact the gear is based on good luck, which many people do not have, it is similar to having to pay on official server which many people cannot afford. Either way it is an impediment.

The point about this being a private server with a much more reasonable "grind" became relevant when you made the ridiculous relation between this server and the official server that almost required you to pay literally thousands of dollars to remain relevant. There's a massive difference.

Also, getting good R8 stats is part of getting the gear, and this entire thread is about people whining about how hard it is to get the stats, and in a sense, how hard it is to get R8 gear.

Many people can't play the hours required to level to 150. Should we then give everyone free level 150 characters?
Many people can't spare the hours required to farm nirvana/dragon gear. Guess we should give them free gear now.
Many people aren't good enough to PvP on here, guess we should give them some sort of advantage to help them beat other players.

Your "Many people can't..." argument is endless.

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Also, you're saying that a person has to be more skilled in dragon to beat a r8r player. I did not know that was considered fair on a balance server where we all should get balanced gear. A dragon player has to work its but off to try and kill the r8r opponent, where as the r8r player doesn't have to try as hard. Hmmm I find your logic here baffling now.

You stated dragon gear is obsolete. I stated that players with dragon gear and a little more skill can defeat R8 players. When players using dragon gear can defeat players using R8, dragon gear is by definition not obsolete.

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Also since you claim most people are shooting for attack levels (I being someone who is not), wouldn't it be more logical to just create an attack and defense set? This is pretty much the goal everyone is aiming for right? An attack set or a defense set or even both.. Why do we need a luck variable to give that to the community?

I was stating dragon gear is even more useful in mass PK, because most people don't aim for defense levels.

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2. Who said anything about everyone having the same stats? Dragon gear does not have the same stats for every class. Example would be the magic weapons. Arcane classes can choose between the glaive, wand, magic sword, and pataka which all hold different stats and it still upheld balance.

Dragon gear is still very generic, even if you have an amazing four choices between magic weapons. R8 has different stats for almost every person. That's huge compared to giving four choices between weapons.

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3. The purpose in which gear provides the ec sink is because ornaments have set stats. Take for example the cube neck and warsong belt. Those are very expensive pieces to buy and they are hard to farm. It is not like r8r which is based on luck and allows you to be more powerful than everyone else if you are extremely lucky. I don't mind testing my luck when it comes to things like engraving rings, for such small lucky bonuses to my gear. Also my using the supreme robe as a reference is the fact that it is hard to get and has set stats. People know what they are working for. I know it does not provide and ec sink, but it could if devs ever wanted to put a price on it.


Okay, where is the EC sink in R8? Oh, rerolling? How would one justify constantly rerolling on gear if it always had the same set stats? There you go.

With R8, some people get lucky, sure. However, a lot of players farmed like crazy and after spending thousands of EC on rerolling they eventually got the great stats they were aiming for.

Also, first you say farming the domination robe is great, then you suggest turning it into an EC sink rather than having people farm it. Now you just aren't making sense.

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4. If there was not a problem, this thread would not have been made and there would not be people replying who are mad.

You're an idiot if you think every thread that pops up proves there's a problem with how the server's being run. What about all those "STILL LAGGY NO x2 Y????" Clearly the server was in dire need of double drops because people were suffering from lag.

Your logical leaps confuse me to no end.

Offline Elly

  • Agony awaits
Well here's another one of those threads that's leading nowhere.
Let's take a look at, for example, wizard pants. http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/32290. Since stats on wizard set weren't edited at all, they are the same as on original version of the game. Now, there's 11 possible stats that are 8.47% chance to get. Useless ones would be + dex, hp recovery, mp recovery, +MP and maybe evasion. That's 6/11 chance to get a good stat on one of the stat slots, plus there are 3 more stats with slightly lower chances to obtain which are also good. So, you are eventually bound to get something that's relevant to a class you play.

Now, most of the people that are ranting on this thread are sins, which is ironic because they are one of the classes that can actually get those ridiculous intervals on armor which increase your attack by a lot if you already have a lot aps (One interval gives 20-25% attack and faster chi gain). Yet, none of the magic classes got chances for -channeling on wrists increased and it's like 5 times less powerful than interval on assassin.

I like the system as it is at the moment (the system, not the way stats were balanced among classes). I always liked RNG because it guarantees you will have different gear from everyone else.

Elly - 150 Sage venomancer
Decipher - 150 Demon mystic

[22:32:11] Chad: the name rev
[22:32:13] Chad: is foul language

Offline Feone

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I agree with Elly on most of these points. Having unique gear is nice. One thing I really don t like though is that the gap in power between really good r8r gear and decent/normal r8r and in a much larger degree dragon gear is so huge.

For example the wizards getting ~95% or more base channeling allowing them to throw spells instantly and at well over 1 spell/second.  Or sins getting so much interval that they can use their genie to boost themselves to 3.33-5 aps with GoF daggers AND the +attacklvl bonus from r8r. Psy's getting massive attacklevel and massive defenses... Blademasters getting so much elemental defense that they become nearly unkillable.. 

The list goes on, dragon players and in a somewhat lesser degree r8r need not bother fighting these people because the gap in gear is so PWI style huge that they will just get rolled by default. Farming for a little bit of advantage is fine but it should never be so much of an advantage that those without it lose by default, no matter of the skill involved. (Mostly the way interval and channeling can be stacked on r8r to the point where these people get both the boost in survivablity and damage that comes with r8r while still stacking more attackspeed than dragon gives..)

Offline l7ixil7

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I think EPW should either increase the ec drop or increase the chance of getting good stat. Like TS,  I had also spend like couple of thousand of ec just to get reasonable stats and still trying. Anyway by suggesting or giving honest feedback about ec, most of the times, ppl always simply accuse u are greedy or lazy which are baseless accusation, if not they'll say its gonna hurt the economy. So wth really gonna to hurt the ingame economy so much ec, in the end the ec price in the forges are still fixed and tons of ec still dump into the reshape forges. Of cos, u can simply say it is easy to farm or easy to get the stats if you have plenty of time or you get your stats on the first few tries... it really frustrating when u manage to farm some ec and then you get poor stats.

How many topics are you gonna cry in about people disagreeing with your 2x scroll?

increasing drop rates WILL hurt the economy. So what if people are using some to make gear other people will be using it to buy other stuff that doesn't take money out of the economy.

say I get 30 ec a hour in the first pv. double that and its 60 ec I am now farming stuff double the rate I was before now if everyone on the server starts pulling in double what they get isnt all gonna be used on rank 8 reforge now is it? say I farm for 24 hours on nothing but EC what exactly would happen if I increased to double? People who think it won't hurt the economy aren't greedy they are just dumb.

Seriously, people like you should keep your dumb comment to yourself and are you so dumb that you cannot even read this thread that did I still mention about the 2x scroll. Anyway the 2x scroll thingy was post in the suggestion unless you are trying to hint gm to remove the suggestion thread and ppl like you should be proud that you always try to silence others ppl suggestion, maybe you should try to suggest something and get a feel how ppl respond to your thread...  Btw you think everyone is like you, always farm for ec, 24 hours farming? Or are you trying to hint that you are using bot..hmm.. so can you really explain how exactly will it be hurt the economy? Thanks for insulting players like me and the rest for dumb... ;)

please what is dumb about my comment? I have posted suggestions and people responded postively to them because what do you know they didn't hurt the economy. You are an idiot I never said I do farm for 24 hours I said if I did. Even if just people farmed for 2 hours normally thats still bringing in 4 hours worth of stuff if you double it. Please think before you speak.

Also just because you didn't mention 2x scroll you were still crying about people disagreeing with you bolded it to prove my point.

Look Esco, if you feel upset about ppl comment about you being dumb then you shouldn't start first. I don't feel anything or upset about my previous thread and I don't even bother to mention it in this thread. Just because you ASSUME is it, you shouldn't start with such rude reply. I just wanna to vent about how hard to get the R8 stat which is relevant to what this thread about till you started. I don't meant to be offensive. Anyway I gave up on this thread, no matter how sad ppl qq about R8 stat, there will be always ppl come to defend the fact it is not. As some had said, this thread is leading nowhere, and the TS already gave up her venting. :))
Last Edit: Mar 03, 2013, 01:38 am by l7ixil7

Offline l7ixil7

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No you dumbass (excuse me for using this term), he was making an example of how if ec rates were increased.  It will take half the time for people to farm stuff (which is fine and dandy), but the economy will suffer.  Not everyone is gonna use it on r8 (which is a very viable ec sink); and you can't exactly npc them, so where is all that ec gonna go?  It's just gonna switch hands.  Then you'll have 59723047032957324325234 ec's in circulation.  And then people, out of greed or whatever, will raise the prices for stuff.  For example, gold right now is 25 ec's.  If there's more in circulation, prices can double or triple.  Because folks WILL have that much EC to burn, even if they do use it on r8r.
 

Yes, there will be tons of EC floating which I agreed. However when there are tons of ec floating, more players will easily get their R8s and more ec will still sink into rerolling. The example you had quote might apply to a limited players, and no new players joining or no new alts being created. If prices of ec keep raising, it means more demands are needed and ec is not enough to cope with the raising population. If ec is increased, it might not hurt the gold prices, as most stuff can still be bought in boutique forge and ppl will avoid buying costly gold. The reason for gold sellers to increase the ec price is they desperate for ec.. just my thought and I know most of you might disagree anyway but its ok.  :smiley:

Offline kaseimars

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  • Anything Could Happen
1. Clearly you had to throw in the fact that this is a private server that allows you to level quickly and supposedly gain end game gear within a few weeks to make your statement valid. But it is completely off topic to this thread and to my post. For one, no one has complained about how hard it is to get the gear. Its duh simple. The complaints are about getting decent stats. Btw, my logic is exactly on point because the fact the gear is based on good luck, which many people do not have, it is similar to having to pay on official server which many people cannot afford. Either way it is an impediment.

The point about this being a private server with a much more reasonable "grind" became relevant when you made the ridiculous relation between this server and the official server that almost required you to pay literally thousands of dollars to remain relevant. There's a massive difference.

Also, getting good R8 stats is part of getting the gear, and this entire thread is about people whining about how hard it is to get the stats, and in a sense, how hard it is to get R8 gear.

Many people can't play the hours required to level to 150. Should we then give everyone free level 150 characters?
Many people can't spare the hours required to farm nirvana/dragon gear. Guess we should give them free gear now.
Many people aren't good enough to PvP on here, guess we should give them some sort of advantage to help them beat other players.

Your "Many people can't..." argument is endless.

Quote
Also, you're saying that a person has to be more skilled in dragon to beat a r8r player. I did not know that was considered fair on a balance server where we all should get balanced gear. A dragon player has to work its but off to try and kill the r8r opponent, where as the r8r player doesn't have to try as hard. Hmmm I find your logic here baffling now.

You stated dragon gear is obsolete. I stated that players with dragon gear and a little more skill can defeat R8 players. When players using dragon gear can defeat players using R8, dragon gear is by definition not obsolete.

Quote
Also since you claim most people are shooting for attack levels (I being someone who is not), wouldn't it be more logical to just create an attack and defense set? This is pretty much the goal everyone is aiming for right? An attack set or a defense set or even both.. Why do we need a luck variable to give that to the community?

I was stating dragon gear is even more useful in mass PK, because most people don't aim for defense levels.

Quote
2. Who said anything about everyone having the same stats? Dragon gear does not have the same stats for every class. Example would be the magic weapons. Arcane classes can choose between the glaive, wand, magic sword, and pataka which all hold different stats and it still upheld balance.

Dragon gear is still very generic, even if you have an amazing four choices between magic weapons. R8 has different stats for almost every person. That's huge compared to giving four choices between weapons.

Quote
3. The purpose in which gear provides the ec sink is because ornaments have set stats. Take for example the cube neck and warsong belt. Those are very expensive pieces to buy and they are hard to farm. It is not like r8r which is based on luck and allows you to be more powerful than everyone else if you are extremely lucky. I don't mind testing my luck when it comes to things like engraving rings, for such small lucky bonuses to my gear. Also my using the supreme robe as a reference is the fact that it is hard to get and has set stats. People know what they are working for. I know it does not provide and ec sink, but it could if devs ever wanted to put a price on it.


Okay, where is the EC sink in R8? Oh, rerolling? How would one justify constantly rerolling on gear if it always had the same set stats? There you go.

With R8, some people get lucky, sure. However, a lot of players farmed like crazy and after spending thousands of EC on rerolling they eventually got the great stats they were aiming for.

Also, first you say farming the domination robe is great, then you suggest turning it into an EC sink rather than having people farm it. Now you just aren't making sense.

Quote
4. If there was not a problem, this thread would not have been made and there would not be people replying who are mad.

You're an idiot if you think every thread that pops up proves there's a problem with how the server's being run. What about all those "STILL LAGGY NO x2 Y????" Clearly the server was in dire need of double drops because people were suffering from lag.

Your logical leaps confuse me to no end.

1. There is no huge difference in my relation of the games. 1 uses luck, 1 uses money. Both are things some people do not have. That is all there is to that point. It is not about remaining relevant (how you even come up with that is beyond me) or whatever else goes on in your mind. I'm pretty sure I made it clear twice that that is all the relation is about, it being an impediment x.x jesus

No matter how you word it, it does not make you right. Getting gear and getting decent stats on gear is and always will be two different subjects.

Many people cant play for hours to level to 150? They have the option to donate and buy super level scrolls. Your the one jumping to giving them free stuff.
Many people can't farm gear? They have the option to donate, trade their gold for ec, and buy nirvana gear. You are the one jumping to free
Who said anything about giving anyone advantages? This server is supposed to be balanced through all of the many changes one of them being gear. Players are supposed to be on a level playing field based on game mechanics. Skill level is up to the player. The fact that people have to have a higher skill level to beat someone who's gear is unbalanced to everyone elses is not fair. Hence my point? Rank 8 recast gives that advantage to players who are extremely lucky though. Didn't think of that did you huh?

2. I said dragon gear is becoming obsolete. Nowhere in my statement did I say it already was. Learn to read.

3. Rank 8 may offer different stats to every class but there is no guarantee they will get them. I.e to all the people who have spent tens of thousands of e.c. trying to get good stats. That is a frustrating thing that no one should have to go through. Like I said, gambling is an option in rl and should only be an option here too.

4. THE POINT IS NOT REROLLING. OMG how many times did I STATE ornaments have set stats? The can be made pricey or hard to farm. examples being cube neck and warsong belt. Those are great ec sinks right there, they are expensive. People know what they are aiming for. I never said anything about ec sink being on rank 8 in the first place. Now your just completely babbling nonsense to try and make yourself look good.

I did not suggest turning it into an ec sink. I clearly said it "could" become an ec sink if devs ever wanted to put a price on it". My whole point which is sad that I have to even explain again because I am damn sure I explained it well is that ornaments, and that robe have set stats. People work hard or spend tons of ec for them and know what they are getting. It's really not that hard to understand hun I mean really x.x

5. I want you to read that again and see how idiotic you sound yourself. You clearly just said that those "still laggy no 2x" post actually had a problem because people were still lagging and dc'ing. Which must mean the post on the forum are actual problems with the servor :O. And to further verify that, I also dc'd after 2x was turned off and lagged alot so I know for a fact those posts were true.

I'm not coming back to this post to even argue with you. You clearly cannot read.
~Demon Mystic~Raien~

dickroman

i say r8 goes back off the server with no refunding and we all go back to dragon

Offline jhonies

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i say r8 goes back off the server with no refunding and we all go back to dragon

And then everyone who has R8 in the community will be raging at you for making this suggestion (unless of course you're trolling.) Even so, suggesting this is a way to get people to vent some anger on you so...yeah be prepared for that. ^^

dickroman

i got r8 that many ppl would envy and i only wasted like 30k ec for both bm and wiz gear, i could show u SS of gear but too lazy, no no troll, would simply end the arguing bout r8 not fair stuff

Offline jhonies

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True, it would end it. But even still, some people wouldn't like it BECAUSE they had to farm all of that EC and stuff for their gear just to have it removed. That's like giving someone cake and after they've eaten it they have to cough it back up x.x

dickroman

True, it would end it. But even still, some people wouldn't like it BECAUSE they had to farm all of that EC and stuff for their gear just to have it removed. That's like giving someone cake and after they've eaten it they have to cough it back up x.x

how many of those crying rly farmed it? i say the mostly donated

Offline jhonies

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True, it would end it. But even still, some people wouldn't like it BECAUSE they had to farm all of that EC and stuff for their gear just to have it removed. That's like giving someone cake and after they've eaten it they have to cough it back up x.x

how many of those crying rly farmed it? i say the mostly donated

Eh, still that's money down the drain. Some farmed, some donated which would make it worse because their money would have been wasted (Though on a server where everything can be farmed there's no point in donating anyway -hasn't donated anything- But still it'd be a lot of raging at the GMS. ._.

Offline Escorian

  • Old Player

No you dumbass (excuse me for using this term), he was making an example of how if ec rates were increased.  It will take half the time for people to farm stuff (which is fine and dandy), but the economy will suffer.  Not everyone is gonna use it on r8 (which is a very viable ec sink); and you can't exactly npc them, so where is all that ec gonna go?  It's just gonna switch hands.  Then you'll have 59723047032957324325234 ec's in circulation.  And then people, out of greed or whatever, will raise the prices for stuff.  For example, gold right now is 25 ec's.  If there's more in circulation, prices can double or triple.  Because folks WILL have that much EC to burn, even if they do use it on r8r.
 

Yes, there will be tons of EC floating which I agreed. However when there are tons of ec floating, more players will easily get their R8s and more ec will still sink into rerolling. The example you had quote might apply to a limited players, and no new players joining or no new alts being created. If prices of ec keep raising, it means more demands are needed and ec is not enough to cope with the raising population. If ec is increased, it might not hurt the gold prices, as most stuff can still be bought in boutique forge and ppl will avoid buying costly gold. The reason for gold sellers to increase the ec price is they desperate for ec.. just my thought and I know most of you might disagree anyway but its ok.  :smiley:

The price of EC isn't going up because of how little EC there is. The price of EC is going up because there are too many regular coins coming in with no coin sink.  Also I wasn't crying because you called me dumb I was pointing out you said I made a dumb comment so please tell me what is dumb about my comment. Also you were trying to argue that you didn't complain about your last topic yet again the words I highlighted proved you were complaining other players disagreeing with you.

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Offline l7ixil7

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I think EPW should either increase the ec drop or increase the chance of getting good stat. Like TS,  I had also spend like couple of thousand of ec just to get reasonable stats and still trying. Anyway by suggesting or giving honest feedback about ec, most of the times, ppl always simply accuse u are greedy or lazy which are baseless accusation, if not they'll say its gonna hurt the economy. So wth really gonna to hurt the ingame economy so much ec, in the end the ec price in the forges are still fixed and tons of ec still dump into the reshape forges. Of cos, u can simply say it is easy to farm or easy to get the stats if you have plenty of time or you get your stats on the first few tries... it really frustrating when u manage to farm some ec and then you get poor stats.

How many topics are you gonna cry in about people disagreeing with your 2x scroll?

increasing drop rates WILL hurt the economy. So what if people are using some to make gear other people will be using it to buy other stuff that doesn't take money out of the economy.

say I get 30 ec a hour in the first pv. double that and its 60 ec I am now farming stuff double the rate I was before now if everyone on the server starts pulling in double what they get isnt all gonna be used on rank 8 reforge now is it? say I farm for 24 hours on nothing but EC what exactly would happen if I increased to double? People who think it won't hurt the economy aren't greedy they are just dumb.

Seriously, people like you should keep your dumb comment to yourself and are you so dumb that you cannot even read this thread that did I still mention about the 2x scroll. Anyway the 2x scroll thingy was post in the suggestion unless you are trying to hint gm to remove the suggestion thread and ppl like you should be proud that you always try to silence others ppl suggestion, maybe you should try to suggest something and get a feel how ppl respond to your thread...  Btw you think everyone is like you, always farm for ec, 24 hours farming? Or are you trying to hint that you are using bot..hmm.. so can you really explain how exactly will it be hurt the economy? Thanks for insulting players like me and the rest for dumb... ;)

please what is dumb about my comment? I have posted suggestions and people responded postively to them because what do you know they didn't hurt the economy. You are an idiot I never said I do farm for 24 hours I said if I did. Even if just people farmed for 2 hours normally thats still bringing in 4 hours worth of stuff if you double it. Please think before you speak.

Also just because you didn't mention 2x scroll you were still crying about people disagreeing with you bolded it to prove my point.

Look Esco, if you feel upset about ppl comment about you being dumb then you shouldn't start first. I don't feel anything or upset about my previous thread and I don't even bother to mention it in this thread. Just because you ASSUME is it, you shouldn't start with such rude reply. I just wanna to vent about how hard to get the R8 stat which is relevant to what this thread about till you started. I don't meant to be offensive. Anyway I gave up on this thread, no matter how sad ppl qq about R8 stat, there will be always ppl come to defend the fact it is not. As some had said, this thread is leading nowhere, and the TS already gave up her venting. :))

Esco, when you replied my first post, you had crafted my post in the way that you were trying to relate it to my 2x scroll suggestion thread by saying that how many posts I'm gonna cry about my 2x scroll. For this, you choose to believe what you think or assume, which, what I meant is in general and I never mentioned a word of "2x scroll" in that post and what I meant in that post is about how people respond mindlessly here as you can see in other ppl threads. If you don't like ppl to say your comment dumb, you shouldn't have said others as well. Anyway let's move on, I'm tired about all these...if I really offended you, I apologize.

As for the ec which I beg for differ cos the word "GREED", as the rarer the item or harder to obtain, the price will go up...like one of posts mentioned, initially the price of ec is 1.2 million when the game was at its initial stage; as the players increase, the demand for ec increase as well...so sellers knew that, they marked up the price.