Replace crit on MG set bonus with 15% def like on other casters

[siergrain]

If not better def, atleast make arcane def proc on DPH mele attack, not only auto attacks

[Plague]

i agree, mage is nothing compared to psychics that hit everything but wrs, regardless of defense level and armor type, for 15ks, while still being able to tank by just pressing one skill.

[infernchidhu]

nerf genie spark and aquaflame armour if planned to give 25% rpd  :smiley:

Your bad, pedro does 100k+, i should post videos where i heirobug u like 10 times in a row 

[Frost]

ur statement was about 1v1, and I said that wr got the upper hand in 1v1 with wiz, and wb oso.
for mass pk, I like wr much more, its more effective class, and wizard not much annoying there as u say.
before I give my wr to my friend, I joined lot of mass pks, and survivability of wr is very high.
it won't die till get debuffed, and after that need AA to kill it or wr have the enough time to get his magic altermarow on.
survivability of wr is much depended on how fast being buffed fast with barb and ep, not the wizard of opposite side, archers are more annoying than wizard itself.
wizard isn't much effective in mass pk, because of very weak defence, any archer without spark can kill u in less than 3sec.
while archer's aoe skill deal 16k on wiz, its really hard to survive. it should be atleast dieng in 3sec while they spark, not just in normal attack.

No I didn't discuss 1v1's mainly. That was Teru. Please quote where I once was doing anything besides agreeing with teru that
wizards are weak in 1v1. All I see was my discussion about mass pk and their true powers against wr's.
This topic is already half/half. So please don't argue with me, argue with other half as well. Also, if your
any good Wizard your output of damage should extremely high 3 sparked. Remember, your not just
doing base magic damage, your doing a large range of elemental damage. That's what gets you. Even
marrowed, a timed 3 spark immobilize can end the battle.

Back to mass pk. If you look at a large % of the server, many people are playing wizards in mass pk now.
Why? High damage output. High kiting ability. And the ability to mess up the key class for mass pk. The BM.

AND WHY DOES EVERYONE DRAG ME BACK INTO THESE DISCUSSIONS?
Can I just please leave in peace, this has been argued and agreed upon.
I just don't get why people can't ever be on the same page about classes.

HOWEVER, this whole thread is going to be biased. If anyone would like. Grab best wr and best wiz and
have them 1v1 each other to end this debate. Just remember, what they call the Wizard. The ANTI-BM! 

have u actually tried to play wiz vs bm and see if its realy that easy?
u saying that wiz easily kills bm, if thats so maybe u should think about ur bm gameplay if u getting killed so easily in 1v1

Go make wr, then 1v1 Swink, Tetai, Pedro, Rev, or Blaze_XT. Then tell me if everything is as easy as you see it.
Also, no need to start indirect attacking me. Calling me out on how I play my class is uncalled for, considering you don't even use it.

I'm out of this conversations. I don't want to be part of this soon to be flame war of a thread >.>

[Bill Dipperly]

No I didn't discuss 1v1's mainly. That was Teru. Please quote where I once was doing anything besides agreeing with teru that
wizards are weak in 1v1. All I see was my discussion about mass pk and their true powers against wr's.
This topic is already half/half. So please don't argue with me, argue with other half as well. Also, if your
any good Wizard your output of damage should extremely high 3 sparked. Remember, your not just
doing base magic damage, your doing a large range of elemental damage. That's what gets you. Even
marrowed, a timed 3 spark immobilize can end the battle.

Back to mass pk. If you look at a large % of the server, many people are playing wizards in mass pk now.
Why? High damage output. High kiting ability. And the ability to mess up the key class for mass pk. The BM.

AND WHY DOES EVERYONE DRAG ME BACK INTO THESE DISCUSSIONS?
Can I just please leave in peace, this has been argued and agreed upon.
I just don't get why people can't ever be on the same page about classes.

HOWEVER, this whole thread is going to be biased. If anyone would like. Grab best wr and best wiz and
have them 1v1 each other to end this debate. Just remember, what they call the Wizard. The ANTI-BM! 

Go make wr, then 1v1 Swink, Tetai, Pedro, Rev, or Blaze_XT. Then tell me if everything is as easy as you see it.
Also, no need to start indirect attacking me. Calling me out on how I play my class is uncalled for, considering you don't even use it.

I'm out of this conversations. I don't want to be part of this soon to be flame war of a thread >.>

i have wr and i didnt have problem killing sab or anyother mage but covenant in 1v1. Your lack of knowledge makes you look stupid meng awfs '-'. Making longs posts that look like book arent good boy.

[☠EvilTouch☠]

i suppose Wizard's are just fine :/
the problem is actually the time it needs to get good stats and 2 good weapons :/
other than that i don't see any problem...
i won't disagree on adding like 10 - 15 % physical defense but i also see no need of it if know how to move on a wiz.

need to find concret reasons and pros and cons to add such thing, stuff like you died to a barb isn't a reason.

[Bill Dipperly]

i suppose Wizard's are just fine :/
the problem is actually the time it needs to get good stats and 2 good weapons :/
other than that i don't see any problem...
i won't disagree on adding like 10 - 15 % physical defense but i also see no need of it if know how to move on a wiz.

need to find concret reasons and pros and cons to add such thing, stuff like you died to a barb isn't a reason.

yes mg end game gear is extremly expansive to get. Adding 10-15% phy res will help lower geared mages but it shouldnt help much end game gear mages since 99% them can't play it like me razor and rob : D

[Frost]

i have wr and i didnt have problem killing sab or anyother mage but covenant in 1v1. Your lack of knowledge makes you look stupid meng awfs '-'. Making longs posts that look like book arent good boy.

Has anyone even READ ANYTHING? Please, before responding, read earlier posts. Not once have I said ANYTHING
ABOUT THEM BEING GOOD IN 1v1's. ONLY ABOUT IN MASS PK. Christ people, you giving me headache.

This is why I dislike debating with people. Nobody can have an appropriate discussion without put downs.

[Bill Dipperly]

Has anyone even READ ANYTHING? Please, before responding, read earlier posts. Not once have I said ANYTHING
ABOUT THEM BEING GOOD IN 1v1's. ONLY ABOUT IN MASS PK. Christ people, you giving me headache.

make a TL DR maybe i read i just see nonsense by a wr that got killed by mg

[FMP]

I agree...the def is so lame atm

[Bill Dipperly]

HOWEVER, this whole thread is going to be biased. If anyone would like. Grab best wr and best wiz and
have them 1v1 each other to end this debate. Just remember, what they call the Wizard. The ANTI-BM! 

Best wr vs Best of any other class, best wr wins.

[☠EvilTouch☠]

enough maxy -.-


the problem here is...we add those 15% to "help" those less knowledge players but then we will be helping those who know eaxctly what to do with a wizard. kinda 2 edged sword...give and take in a sense.

[Bill Dipperly]

enough maxy -.-


the problem here is...we add those 15% to "help" those less knowledge players but then we will be helping those who know eaxctly what to do with a wizard. kinda 2 edged sword...give and take in a sense.

happens the same thing that happens on psy cleric or mystic, you will get another Apprentice or LeiZo or Animassacre on a actually skill requireing class like mage

[Frost]

make a TL DR maybe i read i just see nonsense by a wr that got killed by mg

Please go mass pk and tell me you would survive getting aa'd by a Anti-BM squad of MGs
If you can, then good job to you. You've done what 99% of the BM's can't and are now a god.
I don't know how many times pedro killed me in mass before I joined artifex(Rather not count tbh lol).

Just to clarify once more. I think wizards ARE weak in 1v1. They just a bit too good already in mass
pk. However this thread is all opinion based. There are no facts, no set exacts, just opinions and
personal experiences. That's what all of these threads are for. Not to turn into one guy attacking another.

So let's leave it at that and be friends  :smiley:

If you would like to debate or test with me in game I wouldn't mind helping you with that.
I'd even consent to a recording. If I'm proven wrong, so what. Doesn't mean I'm bad wr.
Just means I'm better at certain things than others, but everyone is like that.

[PedroSner]

I don't 1vs1 , i simply play for mass / smaller scale PK's .

Go make wr, then 1v1 Swink, Tetai, Pedro, Rev, or Blaze_XT. Then tell me if everything is as easy as you see it.
Also, no need to start indirect attacking me. Calling me out on how I play my class is uncalled for, considering you don't even use it.

Well my opinions are based ONLY in mass ( or smaller pks ) not 1vs1's since i don't do them i don't have an opinion about those.

Mages are okay. Our spike damage is high , very high in fact, unless you're considering a full buffed WR that got vit build and insane defensive stauts on his gear. LA or even AA classes die without many problems, EAs specially get hierobug left and right , exception for maybe 5-6 on this server. Barbs , most of them , are DD / Dark , so they're tank habillity is pretty reduced anyways.
Considering aswell most mages are nearly insta cast ( or at least 90% ish CT base or with Quaff for those who use R8 wep) the amount of skills going off , and the chances of hierobug with the high crit rate is very high anyways.
So as for killing i doubt anyone can complain.

Negative side is just defenses. Mage defense is legit sad, you can camp defense wep, cube neck w/e you wish , 1 arrow that purges you at half HP and you got hierobugged by half EAs on server. They dont even need to have amazing gears it's a fact. But i guess you can't have the best of both worlds anyway, so overall , Mass PK perspective , MG seems fine.
Keep in mind we still have endless AOEs , gaining chi nowdays is not a prob with the new water skill either...

So as for Mass PK , there isn't really much i'd say MG needs to be changed ... If you have a decent perception of map , and keep an eye what's arround you , plus time your genie , cooldowns , everything , you won't even die that often , dispite of how squishy you can be.

That's just my opinion.