Comprehensive class guide for balance

[Ninja]

Ok, at first I thought you were serious Elly, not completely but the further I read the more I laughed...

I REALLY REALLY hope you were kidding...

The bit in red leaves me 99% sure your just fooling around, but honestly with some sins you never know.

[Elly]

Yeah, that's a troll. xD
I want my post deleted after cause this is a serious thread, and the post doesn't really fit in. But let it stay for a while, cause that's my opinion of how players that go around yelling "Sins are not OP!" see other classes.

[TornadO]

lol xD dat was fun to read Elly  but i think the classes r good as they are..they thought better at this when they invented 'em i think its all good as they r for now  i also think i would quit playin here if the classes were hav been made like in ur describtion xd

[micropanther]

8.They should be able to take looks of other classes if male, in order to look masculine.

LMFAO!  Your whole post was funny, but that had me creased up!

[geriatrix]

I don't have Sin, and I don't plan to make one.
I'm not saying this for myself:

It is stupid to prevent Sins to use bows. It is even stupid for seeker to not be able to use bow. I can't catch much heads in FC without it. And for Sin is even more stupid to remove their bows.

Sins simply NEED bows for many purposes (in many situations), it is one of important tools for them.

And now for just single one (PvP) someone would try to remove their bows.

~~~~~

"Instead of crippling others, try to improve yourself."

[hotflamie]

I don't have Sin, and I don't plan to make one.
I'm not saying this for myself:

It is stupid to prevent Sins to use bows. It is even stupid for seeker to not be able to use bow. I can't catch much heads in FC without it. And for Sin is even more stupid to remove their bows.

Sins simply NEED bows for many purposes (in many situations), it is one of important tools for them.

And now for just single one (PvP) someone would try to remove their bows.

~~~~~

"Instead of crippling others, try to improve yourself."

im pretty sure white bows can be used by everything and everyone
(for heads)
I agree with not locking bows away from sin... (but simply nerfing them)

[hotflamie]

im pretty sure white bows can be used by everything and everyone
(for heads)
I agree with not locking bows away from sin... (but simply nerfing them, in which i mean lock away dragon bow from sin... nirv bow aint at the same lvl, atleast let 140 bow stay avaible for sins)

[Mirae]

QQ veno's Nix damage should be like in 1.3.6 they are too weak now :\

[Chum]

im pretty sure white bows can be used by everything and everyone
(for heads)
I agree with not locking bows away from sin... (but simply nerfing them)

Seekers can't use the non-custom bows, and Mystics can't use any bows at all.


And @geriatrix: if you check this thread again, please tell me a situation where a sin NEEDS to use a bow (other than FC heads) and I will tell you why you're wrong. <3

[kaseimars]

With the morai update, are you keeping what was added to mystics summons on it that allowed them to be summoned with half the magic bar filled? That would be quite useful and a lot easier than summoning without and having to heal them and transfer magic to them so they can use their skills. They do not survive very easy, so when you summon you should be able to send them in to battle at that moment instead of transferring magic and healing which gives the opponent time to aoe and start killing the pet before it is even used(unless you use the devil). This mostly for mistress and salvation because without magic they aren't really useful until you have the required amount. I am not end game gear here so I do not know if it is even needed then with how fast you will be able to channel, I'm speaking from my play and know it will be nice to summon and get it back into action instead of summon, prepare it, then get it back into action. If you want extra shielding from salvation and need it right then and there you cant get that because you would have to wait for the magic bar to fill up enough to cast the shields(unless you leech it and that costs a spark). Even if it is added or not mystic class is pretty balanced to me. I just think this would be nice and further balance it since summons are key to this char.

[Chum]

(wall of text)

Yeah, the mystic summons will start with half mp after descent.

But even then, endgame they just get murdered in less than a second if you try and use them in PvP. I personally only use the pets for Energy Leech at the moment, though I might try and incorporate them into my gameplay with descent.

[Feone]

L M A O, saying sins NEED bows is just ridiculous. They already have knifethrow for a quick ranged hit.
They have daggers with the absolute HIGEST DPS in the game, they can teleport themselves as well.
I'm sorry but what do sins NEED bows for that can't be done using this stuff? All they need to kill heads is a lvl 1-20 bow, anything above that is just extra power. 

[Delirium]

So was this thread made to instil hope of balance to come to keep players interested but not actually do anything?

[Asmulk]

So was this thread made to instil hope of balance to come to keep players interested but not actually do anything?

The thread was made in hope of gaining some balance, and some of the things on here have been done. However, since Asator has resigned as GM, this thread may be a lost cause unless another GM is willing to take up the call.

In hopes that the latter does happen, I do have a couple of comments.
For the most part classes are balanced for pvp, if you have all of your skills, and know how to use them.

For the psy's white voodoo, the balance for this is not on this server. DoT, DoD, and JSoD (which I will be happy to never see any of these on this server) are meant to balance out atk and def lvl buffs. Rather then trying to nerf or limit the classes, find a way to add some of the balance the game was intended to have, like improving the bless boxes from roll call.

The overwhelming complaint about sins dps being OP has to do with the way the daggers are setup. Since the daggers use stats the same way bows do, sins have a very accurate atk that (for a 150 sin) will crit almost all of the time. If daggers were setup like fists/claws and required a large amount of dex to use, but still required str for dmg, then people would most likely see them as being better balanced. Nerfing the skills wouldn't help with this, it would just upset half of the server population.

Seekers are pretty well balanced. With def lvl buff they can tank well, and ranged atks + ranged aoes gives them good crowd control abilities, if you can deploy the skills correctly. Balance of ranged aoes and atks to a bm is, a seeker can't aoe spam like a bm can.

Barb... well it is the tank, and was never meant to be a true pvp character. Players have put a lot of work in to making them work for pvp, as such it can be very hard to find a true balance for them.

Archer is the sniper class. They are meant to have low def and high dmg output. The goal is to kill the other player before they get close. I have seen many pro archers, and low def never seemed to be a problem for them. In a 1 v 1 situation, the archer is meant to stun then unleash as much dmg as fast as possible. The bigger longer cast time skills are intended for group pvp where the archer can be protected by others while atking.

Veno pets are squishy in pvp, but they are only meant to assist the veno. In pvp the goal is to kill the veno, not the pet. If someone wants to focus on the pet, that gives the veno a great chance to go full offense. If they focus on the veno, and not the pet, then it's a chance for the pet to stun or debuff the opponent.

BMs are well balanced. Damage per hit may not be the highest, but we can aoe spam like no other. BMs also get the highest pdef bar none. With full dragon gear, a bm can boost his pdef over 260K, even if for a short time, with just self buffs. In turn, bms have really low mag def.

I could go on, but the point is that with the exception of the few items that aren't on the server atm, the classes are balanced if people know how to play them.

For items that are missing from the server, such as DoT DoD and JSoD, other items could be improved to make up for the lack. Nerfing will just upset the player base.

[Delirium]

The thread was made in hope of gaining some balance, and some of the things on here have been done. However, since Asator has resigned as GM, this thread may be a lost cause unless another GM is willing to take up the call.

I know that, but as it is practically complete shouldn't Agatio be on to this?