Since things are being nerfed, here's a few other things to add to the list.

[Therras]

Sins werent designed for a pure mass-pk private server. They are 1v1 & PVE gods. Not mass pk specialists. Since you mentioned you got solod by a pet I can only conclude you had no gear on at the time. An owl hits 700 a hit and ~4k bleed on a LA class without buffs. How exactly does this solo you? You weren't lieing about it just being the pet were you? It would be very dishonest to leave out all the circomstances making the damage better just to make your point about pet being OP more valid.

Im not gonna argue about r8r bm's being op. Full godmode on those when they wear a deflvl wep.

about hte owl thing, no, Im not  lying about it. You could possibly add some debuffs? maybe then, this will make a bit of logic to you.

also, Sins 1v1 gods? this only tells me how unexperienced you are in pk, I know that sins were not designed for mass pk, I know that, but I also know sins were not designed to die to a few hits in pk, and you still see people complaining that sins are still op, this just make me laugh. While they nerf our gear because people complaining about "our specialty", they improve others gear when it was not needed (blessings/newpets) and so on.

But I guess you wont get my point, maybe if you ever have the opportunity, I would appreciate that you gain more pk experience on a sin.

GL trying to stop the Owl's nerf.

[Groovy]

I don't get the point of this thread.

Veno already has the strongest debuffs in-game (purge, amp, 0 pdef debuff). If you add good damage to that, you get OP class that everyone will want to play.

Other classes being not balanced is not an excuse to create yet another imbalanced class because following that pattern we will create server where everyone is OP and personal skill doesn't matter anymore.


Even after bleed nerf veno will be stronger than before introducing new pet so it is a buff overall, no?

[Animassacre]

I Agree,archers/wizards hit hard,anyway for a Psychic its impossible to beat a mystic,Venos was much op and without Owl pet,Thats just make them 2x much op xD
i will leave GMs to work on that they knows what to do

[dickroman]

I stll dont get how veno can be op...

[Feone]

Venos deal less damage WITH those debuffs on the target than wiz, psy or mystic deals regularly.
You're also forgetting that every other magic class has far superior defenses as well as spammable self-heals. Veno's have 1/3rd the pdef of a wiz, 1/2 that of a cleric/mystic and nothing like SoS etc like psy's do.

I'm not against a nerf on the bleed. Like I said before, cutting it in half would be good. I'm just pointing out that things like wizard firecombo, mystic absorb soul or various other classes have things that are equally OP.


Jolhans, I'm sure you love the "Im pro and you don't know anything" routine but you're just making yourself sound dumb. You can't find any legit counter to my points so you switch to ad-hominem arguments? Really, if you can't dominate 1v1's on a sin maybe you aren't as good as you think you are. Neither did I say sin damage should be nerfed. I mostly pointed out the Relentless Courage genie skill allowing GoF sins to hit 4+ aps from stealth to insta-kill most arcanes. (Several Outcasts sins are especially fond of this tactic.)

And to all those saying venos are op.

Veno vs psy: veno hits ~2-5k, psy hits 8-15k.
Veno vs Mystic. Veno hits 1-3k, mystic hits 10-25k.
Veno vs Wiz , Firecombo instakill, if that fails veno hits wiz for about 2-8k depending on debuffs. Wiz hits 5-10k easily.  These numbers take the demon venomous debuff as well as amplify damage into account. Sages would hit lower.
 HA classes barely notice the bleed unless they are extremely debuffed and LA classes can drop the pet in seconds before it can do a thing. Most other classes can also do this, hell, mystics 1shot all veno pets.  They take forever to resummon.  Just because you don't want to bother to figure out a counter to a new tactic doesn't mean the tactic is OP.

[Animassacre]

Well many ppls says i am good on Psy,But i am full p.def/p.res BUILD armors,with ATK lvl weap,
But defense Build=No Channel,Not enought Magic,i know we have many immune skills,and my defense is good for a psy but my magic atk and channel miss....

[Animassacre]

idk,how but Venos are easy getting and both,good p def and good cast speed/channel
New pet-Owl many peoples says its op,but in my opinion it must be not changed becouse Venos are somthing like pet Class and that helps them when combine with debuffs,Venos are good atm,i dont think so they need changes


Everyclass here is OP,but when u know how to play it,u will see u are more powerfull then an archer/wiz or other 

[Testaclese]

i think the owl bleed makes pk more interesting, they took one of the weaker classes damage wise and gave them a way to be contenders honnestly if just standing there you get plowd by a veno using nothing but her owl then you dont stand a chance vs the other classes anyway and a veno is the least of your worries

[Animassacre]

i think the owl bleed makes pk more interesting, they took one of the weaker classes damage wise and gave them a way to be contenders honnestly if just standing there you get plowd by a veno using nothing but her owl then you dont stand a chance vs the other classes anyway and a veno is the least of your worries

[Zilara]

Everyclass here is OP,but when u know how to play it,u will see u are more powerfull then an archer/wiz or other 

+1

[Animassacre]

+1

[Feone]

Well many ppls says i am good on Psy,But i am full p.def/p.res BUILD armors,with ATK lvl weap,
But defense Build=No Channel,Not enought Magic,i know we have many immune skills,and my defense is good for a psy but my magic atk and channel miss....

Saying your full defensive build psy damage isn't OP has nothing to do with a full offensive psy damage being OP. In my experience channel isn't all that neccesary on psy either. They can simply stack +mag, +def or +crit on their r8r.

idk,how but Venos are easy getting and both,good p def and good cast speed/channel
New pet-Owl many peoples says its op,but in my opinion it must be not changed becouse Venos are somthing like pet Class and that helps them when combine with debuffs,Venos are good atm,i dont think so they need changes


Everyclass here is OP,but when u know how to play it,u will see u are more powerfull then an archer/wiz or other 

My veno, wether its dragon or r8r armor, has 10k base pdef. This goes up a bit in foxform however veno's deal no damage in foxform. To get good channel venos either need dragon gear or very nice stats on r8r.

You are right about the player skill mattering a lot. Assuming both players have similar gear. The better pker usually wins unless it's a class that counters it's opponent.

[Sideris]

If you go against a veno and you don't understand that you have to take down the pet first, then you don't deserve being here complaining about the OP.

I honestly don't understand what's the logic of all this. Pet is the problem? Take down the pet. In mass PK it gets taken down pretty easily anyways due of all the AOEs debuffs/genieskills and whatnot. In 1v1 it takes 1-2 max 3 hits.

Unless seeing a pinky dragon or a fluffy owl come after you makes you run away in tears, you should be able to take it down before it even reaches or touches you.

[Feone]

Very true. THe only way to save the pet from direct attacks is by spam-healing it, taking the veno damage out of the equation entirely.  Most melee classes can simply stun the veno and kill the pet and then kill the veno. Resummoning it takes so long it's pretty much a free-kill for the opponent. Not to mention if the veno does manage to summon it a well timed aoe will instantly drop it before it can be healed back up from near-0 hp.

[Animassacre]

Very true. THe only way to save the pet from direct attacks is by spam-healing it, taking the veno damage out of the equation entirely.  Most melee classes can simply stun the veno and kill the pet and then kill the veno. Resummoning it takes so long it's pretty much a free-kill for the opponent. Not to mention if the veno does manage to summon it a well timed aoe will instantly drop it before it can be healed back up from near-0 hp.

How i Says Owl is Good thing for Veno,They are Pet Class and they need good pets