EC Pricing debate (Old Shop thread)

[𝒦𝒾𝓉𝓉𝑒𝓃]

Does that mean there's an open spot now?   I want one. 

[Astralis]

Since I spent my EC and I don't play the game or draw anymore to farm em up, and since I don't have enough to pay you, I'll leave my spot to Elene or Cassie

[𝒦𝒾𝓉𝓉𝑒𝓃]

Since I spent my EC and I don't play the game or draw anymore to farm em up, and since I don't have enough to pay you, I'll leave my spot to Elene or Cassie

Awh this sweetie.   

[Reikarah]

[quote author=Ely

[𝐋𝐢𝐧𝐚]

I get where you guys are coming from but I'm going to go into the math for you all. I don't think a lot of you understand the business world, or have had any experience doing freelancing professionally. It concerns me because I don't think you guys appreciate just how valuable your art is.


Let's say I average these portraits for 6 hours. Miminum wage where I live is $ 11 per hour. I have 19 years total experience drawing. 4 years professionally. (This in any other business would make me at least above entry level wage.) So I am asking for the equivalent of $20 in the form of game tokens. Not real money that I could spend anywhere. But game tokens only valid in this specific game.

20 fake dollars / 6 hours = $3.33 in fake dollars


A lot of artists on this board are charging less than this. This is slave wages. In the real world this would not fly. It wouldn't pay my bills, it wouldn't even buy me a cup of coffee. In what business in your country can you expect $3 per hour as a skilled professional? In what business in your country is that even legal?


I want to stress that I am not angry, but I want you guys to understand this when you're selling your art whether it's for gaming compensation or real world compensation. The reason that art is pricey is 1. Because the artist is sacrificing time out of their life to make something specific for a client. 2. Art is a custom hand made luxury - you are paying for someone's personal skill and experience (that you do not have) and 3. Artists are self employed. They do not have employers or unions that cover their health insurance. Though the last point isn't quite applicable here. I have a very busy life, I don't get a whole of time to play games as it is. So doing this is a nice way to compensate for that fact.


Keep in mind, if you wouldn't complain about the price the plumber charges you for his personal experience in fixing toilets, it would then be rude to complain to an artist about their prices. I don't mind it here, but I hope none of you do it elsewhere in a professional setting. Either way, I'm trying to comb through the list to add/ remove people.

damn..that's somehow true...

[Neve]

damn..that's somehow true...

It is.
I'd agree with your math 100% if this would be DA or a Art forum meant for selling/ buying art.

This is a gaming forum though. Selling your art here is more a way of farming ec than anything else.
How many hours would you need to farm ns or ws to make 8k ec?
That's the time people spend making the ec to pay you for the time you spend drawiing.
It's somewhat of a time/ time tradeoff.
Farming gets dull and boring very fast, so you having the talent to draw pretty art can avoid that and do something you enjoy more to make ec instead.
That's how i see it at least.

Still not saying there is anythign wrong with you raising your prices, not at all.
Just explaining why some of us consider them a bit too high. No offense.

On a side note:
" skill and experience (that you do not have) "
Is just not true. Some of our artists are / were on your list and do have that kind of skill.

Either way, i wish you the best of luck with your shop, i saw people are already filling up those free spots.^^

[Jaye]

I get where you guys are coming from but I'm going to go into the math for you all. I don't think a lot of you understand the business world, or have had any experience doing freelancing professionally. It concerns me because I don't think you guys appreciate just how valuable your art is.


Let's say I average these portraits for 6 hours. Miminum wage where I live is $ 11 per hour. I have 19 years total experience drawing. 4 years professionally. (This in any other business would make me at least above entry level wage.) So I am asking for the equivalent of $20 in the form of game tokens. Not real money that I could spend anywhere. But game tokens only valid in this specific game.

20 fake dollars / 6 hours = $3.33 in fake dollars


A lot of artists on this board are charging less than this. This is slave wages. In the real world this would not fly. It wouldn't pay my bills, it wouldn't even buy me a cup of coffee. In what business in your country can you expect $3 per hour as a skilled professional? In what business in your country is that even legal?


I want to stress that I am not angry, but I want you guys to understand this when you're selling your art whether it's for gaming compensation or real world compensation. The reason that art is pricey is 1. Because the artist is sacrificing time out of their life to make something specific for a client. 2. Art is a custom hand made luxury - you are paying for someone's personal skill and experience (that you do not have) and 3. Artists are self employed. They do not have employers or unions that cover their health insurance. Though the last point isn't quite applicable here. I have a very busy life, I don't get a whole of time to play games as it is. So doing this is a nice way to compensate for that fact.


Keep in mind, if you wouldn't complain about the price the plumber charges you for his personal experience in fixing toilets, it would then be rude to complain to an artist about their prices. I don't mind it here, but I hope none of you do it elsewhere in a professional setting. Either way, I'm trying to comb through the list to add/ remove people.

This is true.. butttttt.... I think most of the people that do it here don't necessarily do it souly for the income.. from what i've seen they do it because they enjoy it.. it allows a creative outlet and they enjoy how it makes others happy to receive it. I understand this is how u make your living so I see why u are so passionate about it but it might do u well to also remember that there is always someone out there that can do the job just as well if not better and is willing to do it at a reasonable price.

[KrowMaet]

Glad you are back , and so nice to see realistic style! as i already said i love your style kishimoto number 2 lol and excited to see other drawing's from you 

[Astralis]

 In what business in your country can you expect $3 per hour as a skilled professional? In what business in your country is that even legal?

Croatia.
But anyway, I agree with your maths and all, but then again I have to agree with Neve.
I never knew how much to charge so I left people to decide themselves.
But honestly, if you want to sell your drawings for real cash (which you should since you said you have that much of an experience) and go into that professionally, why don't you make Patreon?
But either way, only reason why I wanted to get off the list is only because I won't start stressing over drawing for people here again to earn some EC, or to log on and farm on a game I currently cannot stand and I'm pretty poor atm so I can't reach the cap of 8k.

[aquamarina]

I am understanding and appreciating your maths for your prices, and in the professional world it is a a fairly low price for your time and talent.  However, I do feel that this is not the place for professional pricing, this is a game forum. As you yourself said, you wanted to return to commissions as your comic was underway.

"and I have found myself wanting to do art for fun on the side again, hence the shop."

People from all age groups and all walks of life read these forums and many of them would like a personal avatar, and in terms of trading like for like i.e. time taken to farm 8k EC, it may seem that the farmers are paying a very high price. We are all here to enjoy our time, and we are all free to choose how much we would like to spend on our pleasures, so it is not up for anyone to judge how we choose to spend our time and/or EC's.

There are so many extremely talented artists here, all of whom have very different viewpoints. Fortunately, this means we have free choices and markets to choose from.

I commend your marketing skills and wish you every success in your professional life.

[QUITTTTTEEDDD]

So many maddies 

[Echo]

I commend you for changing your prices for the reasons you did.

I'm disappointed in the lot of you complaining and saying the prices are not fair.

It does not matter whether this is a professional setting or not, it does not change the fact that someone is using up their time for you.

And you also can't compare prices of other shops because guess what? They probably aren't charging enough.

Hell I give players pictures for free when I have time(which can take hours and hours of my time), but nobody complains then, right?

You guys say, oh do what you want, but you're still making posts saying her pricing should be more fair.

If the prices are too high, nobody will buy and then she can consider lowering them, there's no reason to publicly reprimand her about it because you feel it's not fair.
If you guys can't pay for it, just go buy from another shop.

[Nea]

the price is fair.
some of u do ares on 30 alts and u get 10k ec / week atleast
if u want to buy just buy
i dont see any of u going infront of apple saying that iphone is expensive and u still buy it =)

[Royal]

I commend you for changing your prices for the reasons you did.

I'm disappointed in the lot of you complaining and saying the prices are not fair.

It does not matter whether this is a professional setting or not, it does not change the fact that someone is using up their time for you.

And you also can't compare prices of other shops because guess what? They probably aren't charging enough.

Hell I give players pictures for free when I have time(which can take hours and hours of my time), but nobody complains then, right?

You guys say, oh do what you want, but you're still making posts saying her pricing should be more fair.

If the prices are too high, nobody will buy and then she can consider lowering them, there's no reason to publicly reprimand her about it because you feel it's not fair.
If you guys can't pay for it, just go buy from another shop.

Couldn't have said this any better
Thank you Cedes 
the people who are whining because of the raised prices aren't worthy of the art anyway

[๖ۣۜĐomgrath]

Why are people crying about prices?

Dear lord, what a bunch of spoiled people.

Her artwork is good, and if you desire to have it, pay for it. Simple as that.

So what if others charge less? Buy from them then. 

OT:

Nice drawings, Luli's was really good. Keep it up, and don't get discouraged by people complaining about the price of things. If they truly wanted your artwork, they'll pay the set price for it. People are so used to everything being "equal" nowadays on EPW it's nearly cringeworthy. I know that if I was going to be spending 6+ hours on a single piece of art, I wouldn't be selling it for dirt cheap.